Loomio
Tue 9 May 2017

Reconfigure Loomio to allow CoTech to make decisions

CL(
Chris Lowis (Go Free Range) Public Seen by 444

Now that we have a fantastic new discussion group for general discussions I think this Loomio should be reconfigured to allow CoTech to make collective decisions.

As a first proposal how about:
- one vote per member coop (as listed on https://www.coops.tech/)
- allow non-members to view, but not vote (or comment)

I think that would allow us to more effectively decide how CoTech works and improve co-budgeting decisions.

CC(

I agree we need to encourage all the discussion to move to community.coops.tech and we need to let all the pending people wanting to join Loomio know that they should head over there etc.

In terms of one vote per co-op or one vote per workers of a member co-op or some other formulation -- I'm not so fussed at this stage as I think we should strive to make as many decisions by consensus as we can and we can probably postpone making a formal decision on the detail of this until our face to face meeting at Wortley Hall in November 2017.

We should also update the top paragraph of this Loomio group and the logo etc while we are at it, (see the wiki for logos).

H"R

Harry "Outlandish" Robbins Tue 9 May 2017

I'd be in favour of this.

It would make it clearer that this is a place for decisions rather than discussions, and that it's about co-ops not individuals.

@chrislowis maybe start a proposal and see what people say?

RB

Roy Brooks Tue 9 May 2017

Ditto.

eg, will migrate the 'CoTech camp '17' org and discussion to a topic on Discourse shortly

CL(

Chris Lowis (Go Free Range) started a proposal Tue 9 May 2017

Reconfigure Loomio to allow collective decision making for CoTech Closed Tue 16 May 2017

Outcome
by Chris Lowis (Go Free Range) Tue 30 May 2017

I made a change to the welcome text for this Loomio group to read:

Everyone is welcome to observe this public group, but
membership is currently only open to members of the
CoTech network (https://www.coops.tech/join).

If you are a member of a CoTech network co-operative
you can participate in discussions and decisions here on > Loomio. Voting on proposals is on the basis of one-
coop-one-vote, so before voting on an issue, discuss
internally and then make it clear when you vote that you > are voting on behalf of your co-operative.

It's difficult to audit the members list for Loomio at the moment, as it doesn't include email addresses and a lot of user accounts don't have an obvious connection to a CoTech member co-op.

If you have an account on Loomio, and your co-operative is a member of CoTech, you can participate in discussions but when voting you should aim to reach consensus about an issue internally and vote once on behalf of your co-op.

If you have an account on Loomio, but are not a member of a co-operative in the CoTech network, please let me know (chris.lowis@gofreerange.com) and I can help point you in the right direction.

  1. Loomio accounts should only be available to members of the CoTech network
  2. Voting should be based on 1-coop, 1 vote

I think 1. could be achieved by allowing accounts to be created using email addresses from an allowed list of domains.

I'm not sure if Loomio supports 2. out-of-the-box, but if members make it obvious which coop they are voting on behalf of, I think it should be possible for us to keep on top of it.

Results
Agree - 10
Abstain - 2
Disagree - 0
Block - 0
12 people have voted (12%)
KWO

Kayleigh Walsh Outlandish
Agree
Tue 9 May 2017

I think we will benefit from using Loomio as a decision making tool, rather than a platform for discussion with endless threads.
1 vote per co-op sounds much more sensible waiting for individuals to vote, and fairer.

SF

Shaun Fensom
Agree
Tue 9 May 2017

DS

Daniel Stanley
Agree
Tue 9 May 2017

H"R

Harry "Outlandish" Robbins
Agree
Wed 10 May 2017

I think it makes it much clearer what Loomio is for and separates it from Discourse

JM(

James Mead (Go Free Range)
Agree
Wed 10 May 2017

CL(

Chris Lowis (Go Free Range)
Agree
Wed 10 May 2017

I proposed this. I think there's some details to work out but it feels like a good thing to do.

CC(

I basically agree, this proposal has the advantage of being nice and simple, but I'm not sure we have really explored if we should have some kind of weighting system so that the votes represent the size of co-ops and not just their existence (with this proposal small co-ops have the same say as the biggest).

JB(

John Bevan (We Are Open)
Agree
Thu 11 May 2017

SW(

Happy to go with the flow but 1 coop 1 vote could be a bit tricky to monitor unless we create more complexity, and runs a bit against the grain of Loomio.

CL(

Chris Lowis (Go Free Range) Thu 11 May 2017

@sionwhellens - by "monitor" do you mean how do we ensure that each co-op only votes once? I suggest either adding your co-op name to your display name (so mine would be Chris Lowis (Go Free Range) for example, or when voting leaving a message saying "I am voting on behalf of ".

@chriscroome do you have an idea of how we could explore this weighting issue further? I think we tend to aim for consensus rather than decisions by simple majority here so I'm a bit less worried about the weighting. I wonder if we could try something simple first, and then try to fix it if we find it is causing issues?

BS

Brian Spurling
Agree
Thu 11 May 2017

Bang on.

SW(

@chrislowis Yes, that's what I meant, and your suggestion would be a good way to keep tabs.

AH(

Sounds like a good way forward (he says on behalf of his coop)

AH(

Might it also be a good idea to start archiving old threads? The older version of Loomio only allowed the creator of a thread to archive, not sure if they have updated this, but it does make sanitising the Group a bit of a pain. Not that I'm a clean freak or anthing, I just like tidyness :smiley:

CR

Chris Roos
Agree
Mon 15 May 2017

JB(

John Bevan (We Are Open) Wed 17 May 2017

Hi @chrislowis, I've flicked a switch so you should be an admin ("coordinator" in loomio speak) now.

H"R

Harry "Outlandish" Robbins Thu 18 May 2017

@chrislowis A potential implementation idea to address concerns raised: We already have shared (one account per co-op) accounts for the website and CoBudget. We could just replicate this in Loomio. This would also underline the fact that Discourse is for discussing and Loomio is for governance.

CL(

Chris Lowis (Go Free Range) Fri 26 May 2017

@harryrobbins I think that's an interesting idea. Having thought about it this week, I'm a bit worried that it might lead to a reduction in debate and discussion around an idea if people feel they have to "speak on behalf" of their organisation.

It would certainly be easier to implement than my original proposal. The current members list in Loomio does not show the email addresses of each user, so I'd have to do quite a bit of digging to match each user to their co-op (and remove those who are not in CoTech).

Any thoughts?

CL(

Chris Lowis (Go Free Range) Tue 30 May 2017

To move forward with this, I've changed the welcome text for this group to read:

Everyone is welcome to observe this public group, but membership is currently only open to > members of the CoTech network (https://www.coops.tech/join).

If you are a member of a CoTech network co-operative you can participate in discussions
and decisions here on Loomio. Voting on proposals is on the basis of one-coop-one-vote, so > before voting on an issue, discuss internally and then make it clear when you vote that you
are voting on behalf of your co-operative.

I think that is easier than changing / deleting user accounts. We can see how it works on the next couple of proposals and make a further change if it is needed then.

H"R

Harry "Outlandish" Robbins Tue 6 Jun 2017

Sounds good to me.

I guess we just need to agree amongst ourselves that people with 'legacy' accounts (e.g. people who are not part of a CoTech organisation) do not count towards votes.

x