Loomio
October 16th, 2018 07:40

Hi VIz Vests

Brian Prangle
Brian Prangle Public Seen by 265

Back in the early days it was possible to purchase a hiviz vest emblazoned with OPENSTREETMAP SURVEYOR and the logo and website. I can't remember who organised it but I vaguely remember they were available at mapping parties.
Mine has proved to be invaluable in avoiding those awkward (and potentially hostile) situations where people are rightly suspicious of you taking notes and photos. It has also helped with over-enthusiastic security guards. Other advantages have been: it engenders lots of extra volunteered information from people you meet; it advertises OpenStreetMap; and is great for road safety when cycling or walking. There is one disadvantage however- in some deprived areas you might be seen as representing "officialdom" and engender a hostile response (all I've received are gentle rebukes from old folk accusing me of planning to take away their postbox or bus stop!)
So the question is: would it be good idea to revive supplying these with a preferential purchase price for members and a higher price for non-members?

DS

Dan S October 16th, 2018 07:43

I'd buy one.

Might have been Harry (or Rob?) had them made up as a one-off batch?

Jez Nicholson (Director)

Jez Nicholson (Director) October 16th, 2018 07:59

I'd have one, as long as it has an OSM UK logo on it. Could get pre-orders so that the batch size isn't excessive.

Robert Whittaker

Robert Whittaker October 16th, 2018 08:17

I think it's a great idea, and I'd be interested in getting one.

L

Locator October 16th, 2018 20:45

Yes count me in please.

L

lakedistrict October 16th, 2018 20:50

I'd be interested.

Found this page about them on the wiki: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OSM_Surveyors_Jacket

RobJN (Director)

RobJN (Director) October 16th, 2018 21:51

Cool there is some interest. Can we find a company (website) that can produce them? How much?

blackadder

blackadder October 17th, 2018 00:15

i think i sorted the set out after Graham and then Andy Allen took it over. Cant recall the supplier Graham and I used. Andy may have had an alternative.

Brian Prangle

Brian Prangle October 17th, 2018 10:37

There are loads of outfits doing this. Price depends on quantity. Roughly £5- £7 each plus delivery for 50-100

Christian Ledermann

Christian Ledermann October 17th, 2018 13:35

+1

Gregory Marler (former Director)

Gregory Marler (former Director) October 18th, 2018 14:32

  • In 2008, Graham Smith had a batch (of only 11 preorders) made and sold at £8.50 + £2 p&p.
    • In 2009, Andy Robinson had 200 jackets available for £10 collection in person (London).
    • In 2010 they were £13.99 inc p&p from Andy Allan (opencyclemap shop) who gave £10 to OSMF (who had paid for however many had been printed, probably from the 200 earlier).

I'm not aware of any batches being made/sold in the UK after that.

I know my brother's business (in Birmingham) does such branded vests, he reckons about £12/vest. He might be able to manage accepting future individual orders after the initial batch (obv not preferable cost wise).

RobJN (Director)

RobJN (Director) October 25th, 2018 21:05

A couple of designs knocked up on highvis.co.uk. Let us know what you think. Printing just on back. The costs are £8.84 delivered (big logo) and £6.45 delivered respectively. Discount on large orders but this would then mean that we would have to distribute them.

It looks like the earlier prints did have a small logo on the front so would need to factor in an extra couple of quid for that.
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OSM_Surveyors_Jacket

L

Locator October 25th, 2018 22:10

Personally I prefer the HiViz one.

Reasoning;
1. Bigger Surveyor lettering.
2. Less extraneous info.
3. Looks more ‘professional’ (Less cluttered)

I also like idea of front logo, as it conforms to most other Hi-Vis styles.

Brian Prangle

Brian Prangle October 27th, 2018 14:09

I'd prefer orange to yellow - conforms to the original hiviz vest back in the day. I also think just generic OpenStreetMap rather than OpenStreetMap UK would be better - for instance it wouls enable us to share the stock with OSM Ireland and if we are left with stock we could could sell them at a future SotM

RobJN (Director)

RobJN (Director) October 27th, 2018 15:35

Orange/yellow were same price. Other colours carried a premium.

Maybe we end up with a couple of options as others may prefer OSM UK - I know I do.

The good news is that these are cheaper than I expected so risk is low.

Robert Whittaker

Robert Whittaker October 31st, 2018 10:45

I prefer HiViz.png over HiViz2.png for the reasons given above by Locator. I'd also prefer "OSM UK" branding rather than just OSM -- to help give the local chapter more of an identity / exposure, but I take Brian's points too. Printing on the front would be good if it doesn't add too much to the cost. I think orange would be a better colour, as it's a bit less generic hi-viz, and matches the previous colour.

Gregory Marler (former Director)

Gregory Marler (former Director) November 1st, 2018 14:38

I think the front (small) logo is important. People see the back from a distance, but many times when I'm questioned face-to-face I can naturally point as I say "I'm updating OpenStreetMap".

The big "Surveyor" on the back is good. Having osmuk.org on the back I prefer, as it directs people to information (we're more than just a map). Although I get that no-UK makes it suitable for many more people and places.

Orange seems more normal/important for the UK. Slight down-side is that you can get mistaken for a postman or railway staff, that's all part of the fun.

RobJN (Director)

RobJN (Director) November 3rd, 2018 12:59

Update: Looking at the original version [1], it looks like adding text between the 2 horizontal reflective strips is unnecessary. It is actually quite low down the back and the space at the top is much bigger in reality than the PNG mock-ups suggest.

Changes: Orange, logo on front, rear more like original but using OSM UK and dropping the website. We would probably do these to order and also create a batch just with OSM (not OSM UK) as we can sell these at a wider range of events. With that in mind we will need a suitable OSM (not OSM UK) logo. The original hi-vis used what is now an old logo.

[1] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OSM_Surveyors_Jacket

Jez Nicholson (Director)

Jez Nicholson (Director) started a poll November 26th, 2018 18:24

We should get hi viz surveyor vests Closed 6:02pm - Wednesday 12 Dec 2018

Outcome
by Jez Nicholson (Director) December 13th, 2018 08:21

We will set up a page on the web site to take money in advance for OSMUK hi-viz vests. It will be advertised in posts to Talk-GB, etc. when ready.

An orange OSMUK vest

8 - Yes, take some money up front so you know how many to get
5 - Yes, get a load then sell them
0 - Yes, increase the annual subs and send one to every member
0 - No, don't worry about it
Andrew Black

Andrew Black November 26th, 2018 18:36

Andrew Black

Andrew Black November 26th, 2018 18:37

Yes, get a load then sell them
YP

Yorvik Prestigitor November 26th, 2018 18:40

Yes, take some money up front so you know how many to get
Steven Horner

Steven Horner November 26th, 2018 19:31

Yes, take some money up front so you know how many to get
N

Neil November 26th, 2018 20:42

Yes, take some money up front so you know how many to get

Option to pay by cheque would be good.

Robert Whittaker

Robert Whittaker November 26th, 2018 21:10

Yes, get a load then sell them

I'd suggest doing both of the first two options, assuming there are benefits for buying in bulk. Get some pre-orders (with or without payment) to guage interest, but then buy extra to have spares to sell later. How many to get may depend on the size of any bulk discounts.

I

Ian November 26th, 2018 21:31

Yes, get a load then sell them
RobJN (Director)

RobJN (Director) November 26th, 2018 21:32

Yes, take some money up front so you know how many to get

For the OSM UK ones we are probably best to take orders upfront. A few would also like a general OSM (i.e. non-UK) one. Here we can probably order a batch as we can sell excess stock at more events (e.g. SotM).

L

Locator November 27th, 2018 13:32

Alexis Markwick

Alexis Markwick November 27th, 2018 13:52

Yes, get a load then sell them
Adam Hoyle (Director)

Adam Hoyle (Director) November 27th, 2018 23:17

Yes, get a load then sell them
Gregory Marler (former Director)

Gregory Marler (former Director) November 28th, 2018 14:06

Yes, take some money up front so you know how many to get

I'd like to also say "increase the annual subs". Might not be completely a silly idea.

Brian Prangle

Brian Prangle November 28th, 2018 15:26

Yes, take some money up front so you know how many to get
Tony Shield

Tony Shield December 11th, 2018 17:05

Yes, take some money up front so you know how many to get
Cristina Viviana Loma Aragonés

Cristina Viviana Loma Aragonés December 12th, 2018 10:23

Yes, take some money up front so you know how many to get
RobJN (Director)

RobJN (Director) December 17th, 2018 23:45

Hi all. I've just ordered a test print. If all works out well I will set up a order form on the osmuk.org website. I think we will process in batches - i.e. place your order and we will collate and pass them on to the supplier (timelines will be made clear when we go live).

RobJN (Director)

RobJN (Director) January 6th, 2019 17:57

Test print arrived and checked by my fellow Mappa Mercia members on Thursday. Passed their quality tests so we are close to launching this. I'm just waiting for a board member to test the payment system to confirm that is all working as expected. At which point it's over to you to place order :-)

L

lakedistrict January 6th, 2019 18:13

Do you have any photos of someone wearing it? I know it's "just a reflective vest with a logo on", but it would be good to see what it looks like in real life. :)

RobJN (Director)

RobJN (Director) January 7th, 2019 23:30

Sales now live. Get yours online: https://osmuk.org/product/osm-uk-hi-vis-vest/

Because we're running this on a volunteer basis at cost, I shall collate a few orders and send them to fulfilment in bulk. I'll send the first order at the end of the month for delivery in early February.

Robert Whittaker

Robert Whittaker January 12th, 2019 11:40

Based on the sample you have, do you have any advice over the sizes? Presumably most people will want their hi-viz to fit over a coat, so should we go up a size from our normal? How does the (presumably) chest size quoted related to the actual circumference of the jacket when done up?

RobJN (Director)

RobJN (Director) January 12th, 2019 18:05

If you have a particularly large coat, then the larger size would be useful. For this sort of thing slightly too big is hardly a issue (it's not fashion wear after all!) but too small / too tight is. If in doubt, go up one size. I didn't but that's because I'm on the smaller size of medium anyway. If you get what I mean!

Gregory Marler (former Director)

Gregory Marler (former Director) January 12th, 2019 18:18

My "original" OSM high-vis is a large (102-110cm) and with even a light coat on it's a struggle to keep together the tattered velcro. With the current OSM UK make it seems this would only be a medium.

I definitely would recommend leaning on the larger size of options you consider. The alternative is to wait till an OSM event and hope someone ordered one that you can try for sizing.

RobJN (Director)

RobJN (Director) January 12th, 2019 18:48

P.s. the label on medium reads: chest 38-40" (EU 48-50). Hope that helps.

Robert Whittaker

Robert Whittaker February 17th, 2019 16:14

I went for a large in the end (although I normally take medium clothes). It was definitely the right choice. For anyone else who's thinking of ordering, the distance from left to right when it's done up and laid out flat is 23".