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Sun 13 Sep 2015 6:36AM

What is our position on the use of the death penalty?

V vik@hamara Public Seen by 417

Indian Pirates should oppose the use of the death penalty. Legal systems are fraught with inefficiency, lack of fairness and outright corruption. In this scenario can we really support a system that provides an irreversible conclusion?
Law changes over time, we cannot bring back the dead who's acts are no longer deemed illegal.

V

vik@hamara Fri 18 Sep 2015 2:40PM

@rajudvindane @praveenarimbrathod @vidyut @karthikeyanak do you guys have any views on this?

KAK

Karthikeyan A K Fri 18 Sep 2015 4:45PM

Some people are afraid of death, and it seems the only deterrent against certain crimes.

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vik@hamara Fri 18 Sep 2015 10:00PM

@karthikeyanak but which crimes are you free of because of this deterrent?

PP

Pirate Praveen Sat 19 Sep 2015 5:03AM

@vik we should stand for abolishion of death penalty.

  1. You already mentioned corruption and chance of wrong conclusions.
  2. When the crime happens mostly, people don't think about getting caught. Even if they are caught poor people are getting punished more than the rich (there is a recent study).
  3. It is about revenge than justice.
V

Vidyut Tue 22 Sep 2015 5:58AM

I have mixed feelings. I am against punishment in general, let alone death penalty. I'd like to find more functional ways to deliver justice to begin with. The idea of society agreeing of norms of behavior to the point of taking life is troubling. Perhaps I do not want to have responsibility for such a decision - which is implied with the judiciary acting on behalf laws created for me - the citizen. This is utopia. At least as of now.

That said, I do understand that in a country fraught with terrible challenges, some situations would justify the death penalty rather than risking lives of others. Repeat offenders in violent crimes, fanatical leaders continuing to inspire and provoke mass violence (who sadly never land in jail), key prisoners who would provide high value targets for blackmail or hostage taking for exchanges, premediated brutality to achieve objectives, etc... I can understand how safeguarding may be beyond the capacity of the state and the most functional (even if not ideal) solution would be the death penalty.

In my view, whatever the state decides, it must be after considered debate and clear to the public. The standards, while keeping some potential for preventing an execution, must not be so vague as to result in a perversion of justice by manifesting unequally across social prejudices like class, caste or religion. Robust process and clear guidelines for sentencing, appeals and execution are important so that neither the state nor prisoners can pervert the system to their ends.

I think the issue with death penalty in India is not so much that it is present, but it is present in a manner that favors some and targets others.

V

vik@hamara Tue 22 Sep 2015 8:06AM

@vidyut I feel like I need to try and convince you further. Perhaps these points will help:

  1. No country that has the death penalty is free from crime - so it therefore does not act as a deterrent.

  2. We have no shortage of solutions for keeping people incarcerated - it's a huge industry. We should not be taking someones life for the sake of saving costs.

  3. None of the pro arguments deal with the case of a miscarriage of just.

  4. More than 117 nations worldwide have abandoned capital punishment in law or in practice. By retaining it we keep company with some of the worlds worst human rights abusers.

V

Vidyut Tue 22 Sep 2015 11:24AM

Thank you @vik. I am convinced. Like I said, I would prefer even a lack of punishment. There is a need to separate justice from revenge.

There are ways miscarriage of justice can be prevented and there is miscarriage of justice in all sorts of punishments. I am merely making points I find somewhat unique to how I think to add to the thought flow.

I'd be happy if the death penalty were done away with. I am merely saying that I accept there are reasons to accept it under unique circumstances. I think there is an urgent need to make the law equal for people who are supposedly equal before it. When the law is not equal, then the death penalty actually becomes a weapon of communal hate - which in my view is even more dangerous than the death penalty alone - a state with laws perverted against some citizens and in favor of others is what we have right now.

V

vik@hamara Thu 24 Sep 2015 3:58PM

Interestingly Pope Francis is addressing the US Congress today on this topic.

"Pope calls on Congress to help abolish the death penalty

The pontiff’s speech continues to address many of what in ordinary circumstances would be considered “third rails” in American politics. Now, he sets his sights on the death penalty.

“The Golden Rule” - “do unto others as you would have them do unto you”, from Matthew chapter 7, verse 12 - “also reminds us of our responsibility to protect and defend human life at every stage of its development,” he says."

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vik@hamara Mon 5 Oct 2015 10:13AM

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