How can we build a little more trust in each other?

English
I trust all human beings, even the evil ones to do their evil plans. So trust is something that I will always put in doubt. And there is no bad guy, there is only wounded children.

I do not need trust in anybody else to do the things I try to do with. I simply «trust them» with all my heart and soul. And if they «disappoint» me, I try to never take it personally.

Trust is a tricky concept; you can «have it» or «loose it», so I do not «need it».

Français
J'ai confiance en tout être humain, même les mauvais pour faire leurs plans diaboliques. Donc la confiance est quelque chose que je mettrai toujours dans le doute. Et il n'y a pas d'être mauvais, il n'y a que des enfants blessés.

Je n'ai pas besoin de la confiance en quelqu'un pour faire les choses que j'essaye de faire avec. J'ai «simplement confiance» en eux de tout mon coeur et âme. Et s'ils «me déçoivent», j'essaye de ne jamais le prendre personnellement.

La confiance est un concept délicat; tu peux «l'avoir» ou «la perdre», donc je n'en ai «pas besoin».

I suppose with a strong visible site like the upcoming where you find what you want , trust will be bigger. It's a bit like a paradox: You are skipping things and opinions of people by going fast but you need that speed to get things done. Too short time means stress, too long time creates the same stress; In social behaviour you build trust by getting to know others, that takes time. The bigger the group becomes , the more you need transparancy by better communication we have the material to do that. The old structures in society do not create trust, I believe we can. I think it's a question of time and keeping the door open for everybody.

Thx. Comforts a bit.

And you know, it is exactly what I have been trying to do: talk to people in person to build trust. I then hear: we should use Loomio to decide on things. I do so "to follow the pirate rules". And everything which has been discussed over the last few weeks - is questioned again.

Great that. :/

trust can not be bought or sold.

it is the inner feeling of the human hart sensing if things are right or wrong.
expectations are the basis of the disillusionment ?

There is nothing wrong with discussion and questioning. It is even elementary in the democratic process. There has been a big mistrust in the past with coreteam and you still feel this. And I sometimes feel 2 directions in this: go back to some core structure with clear rules (and idealists want more rules, because everything will be so cool) and on the other hand: trying to create horizontal structures as anarchistic as possible. If you pile things upon each other without clearly working out this discussion of these 2 directions, you get this pile of shit. The only way you can get out of it, is to create structures that are as simple as possible and to get those working first and make them clear to everyone before haunting our ideal scenario, which in the ideal case, would change a lot as we grow.

I'd like to reply "back to basics" (and I think eventually it will end up in a similar answer as Josse's, though coming from another point...) :

What is trust? If I give you my trust, and vice versa, it means we are setting up a link of dependence ; that you will take actions on which I will have to rely, and vice versa. How can I possibly accept that from you?

1) Acquaintance: we know what each other wants/likes
2) Respect: we have a look on the "past" (see the latin root_respicere_)
3) Transparency: we know what's going on and how

Personally, as for the case of the current "vzw" that you are (not directly) referring to, I see some deficiencies in all three points, in spite of all good will of the people behind (assume good faith, that's a pirate golden rule :smiley: ).

In practice, how can we meet these three points?
For (1) we need a common pirate vision (the basic text is one) and goals (I don't think we have them yet, at least not at national level. Crews have though, I guess).
For (2) we need better transmission to new pirates of how it works here and,
for (3) we have many tools already but we need to make sure all of us can use them comfortably (not the case!!).
So still a lot of work, and that takes time, energy... and patience. The election fever has always brought clashes amongst us because patience runs out :sweat_smile:

"You better respect my mind - cause I'll kill you" wikipedia... oops... :smiley:

I'd say: power to the crews. I do think that the Pirates are what they are because of the crews. The decision making process is easier and faster in the crews. I'd say something about the bsw : who cares if the Pirate party does not want it? Justechange it: bsw for Ghent's crew for example. You'd do exactly the same for your crew. Then maybe one day the Pirates would understand that to move on it's not only trust but changing the whole strategy of the party by acting and not trying to reinvent the wheel behind a computer.

1) It is never bad to be weary about people who get power (or grab it). For people who want to have power, trust must be earned.
2) Once you make your intentions transparent and answer to all possible questions about what you are planning to do (in the name of the pirates), people will start to encourage en support you.

I can't trust someone who's intentions are not clear (though tit-for-tat indicates that giving some initial trust as default is a good option).

We Pirates actually trust each other very much, especially if you meet them. Pirates have a sense of optimism (we actually are crazy enough to believe we can change the world). So: please act and organize.

As soon as you feel "distrust": be transparent.